Monday, September 04, 2006

Hiding in the shadow of death

It is rather unbelievable that a military state such as Israel keeps on escaping international regulations as and when it deems necessary. The IDF knows that the wars it wages are not morally correct, yet it keeps on continuosly 'erasing villages' without solid evidence that these villages are being used by so-called 'terrorists'. And what are the results of such actions? Well apart for the thousands of dead caused by the Israeli war machine, Israel will continue on being considered a state serving a barbaric war machine. The following article is the latest describing how Israeli officials are trying to escape from being tried as war criminals.

Officials said fearing wave of war crimes suits over Lebanon
By Haaretz Service

The Foreign Ministry fears a wave of lawsuits accusing Israeli military and governmental officials of war crimes, Army Radio said Monday, adding that a report prepared by the ministry's chief legal advisor warns officials against inflammatory statements in connection with the recent war, saying that their words could later be used against them in foreign lawsuits or indictments for alleging them to be war criminals.In the past, a number of IDF generals have deferred visits to Europe, for fear of arrest over allegations of war crimes in connection with the Intifada.Cabinet Minister Yitzhak Herzog, currently traveling in Finland, said Monday that international conventions granted government officials immunity from prosecution, but that the problem was "much more complicated" with respect to IDF officers, especially retired officers.
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"There is no question that there is an effort by organizations of various kinds to harm, in particular, [IDF] officers and commanders. This certainly doesn't touch the governmental echelon, but this takes nothing away from the seriousness of the problem." According to Herzog, after the Intifada, Israel approved "an envelope of legal defense to senior officials and officers, and I believe that the outline that the Foreign Ministry is proposing for many of these issues, is a correct one."Cabinet minister Eli Yishai and former justice minister Haim Ramon are among those who have been mentioned as having made especially harsh statements in wartime, during which Israeli ministers were quoted as having advocated "taking down" villages which served as shelters for Hezbollah.Legal authority Yael Ronen said Monday that some officers or government officials who traveled to Europe stood the risk of being arrested."In connection with war criminals, international law holds that due to the severity of the charges, nations may bring the accused to trial, no matter where the crimes were committed, nor against whom," she told the radio.Herzog said he had spoken with Attorney-General Menachem Mazuz on the issue during the war. "He stated that the army was taking all of this under consideration, and was acting according to the rules, and had certainly internalized this consideration in its actions."

56 Comments:

Blogger HCB said...

It seems to me the "International Force" ought to convene an "International Court Martial" and try Olmert and Prevetz for crimes against humanity. The form of the indictment has already been prepared by Amnesty International. How delicious it would be to see them in the dock. How especially delicious and ironic it would be to have newspapers run side by side photos of them and of Adolph Eichmann in the dock. I believe I would keel over in a deep swoon if there were a sidebar picture of the prisoners in the dock at Nuremberg.

And - when they squeal "but America made us do it," bring in the appropriate co-conspirators.

Yes, Mr Wrath, I know I'm extreme. Yes - I can see all those other faces reddening in self assured anger over me saying such things. Some day - some day when reason returns to the United States and the Israeli war machine funds are at least reduced substantially - then Israel is going to have to figure some other way than bombing and blockading to get along. I don't believe, in my heart of hearts, that even Israel's powerful Washington, DC lobby can convince our government to stay the course forever until every single person who hates Israel has been killed. There's just too many of them being born every day.

5:28 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

It just occurred to me that I have been suggesting for a while that Israel needs to figure out a way to get along with the people all around it other than by killing them. But I haven't offered any ideas how to do that.

I think Israel sees itself as a bunny rabbit plopped down with a wolf family hoping the wolves will raise it. The wolves, naturally, see the situation differently. But - there's precedent on how to survive and prosper as the bunny rabbit. Israel ought to have it's foreign and tourist ministries spend a year or so with a Catholic Mission somewhere. Go to the missionary school, learn the basics and then go out into the heathen world. Catholics converted heathens of all stripes - even cannibals. Some of them got eaten, of course, but most did not. And there are many pictures of happy faces surrounding the nun who came with nothing but love to help the downtrodden and lost.

It's not likely God loves Catholics more than Jews so it's more likely its the Catholic approach to hate and fear that keeps them alive in the world of the heathen.

It's worth a try, Israel. Isn't it?

5:52 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

History of Jews

Not all Jews are bad

http://www.thewatcherfiles.com/jewish_sacrifice.htm

6:41 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

I agree m2. I distinguish between "Jew" and "Israel." I further agree that not all Israelis are "bad" - just like not all Americans are "bad." It's the people in charge. But it's also the majority of people in a democratic society who let the bad things happen. They are not "bad" themselves but they turn a blind eye to the badness that is done in their names.

6:58 PM  
Blogger Doc said...

m2timechange---i try not to confuse the jewish people with the israeli government--we are not at odds with the policies of jewish persons (which come from all countries), but rather the Israeli govt and its political allies

7:01 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

So we have to change those leaders
Remember people’s power

A leader play important role in any organization and country. He must lead by good example with good character, humble and integrity. I have been to Houston and San Francisco on 6 occasions (company business trips 1995 - 1996). I have met the cowboys (our customers) and well taken care by them.

BTW, Israel is US proxy, they will remain there and the worst has yet to come. Major players, the conspirators in this conflict are the neo con Zionist and CIA. They will continue with their mission to occupy where ever they wish. The democrat will be less hawkish if they are back in White House.

Toady, US market closed, I shall sleep early.

doc, you are right, Israel is the country.

7:35 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Monday, September 04, 2006
List of collective massacres perpetrated by Israeli Army in its attack against Lebanon in summer 2006

http://angryarab.blogspot.com/

8:05 PM  
Blogger Solomon2 said...

hcb, m2t:

"I can think of nothing more poisonous than to rot in the stink of your own reflections."

8:39 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Well, Solomon, I hadn't thought of it that way. But now that you mention it, I suppose that's right. Of course, it presumes you are able to recognize your reflection, n'est ce pas? And, if anyone should be able, it would be "Solomon" - right? I mean, as in "the wisdom of ...."

By the way - did you just make that up? Or did someone famous say it? It sounds like Homer Simpson but it's probably somebody like .... well, I give up.

9:36 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Wow - Solomon - I just read some of your blog. You have some serious sicknesses going there. Not to mention ignorance and bigotry.

I'm not sure what to recommend. But the first thing that comes to mind is a desert island. That's probably best - an island. Surround it with an electric fence. And sharks - lots of sharks. Anti-ship mines. Torpedos. Claymore anti-personnel mines and remotely controlled cluster munitions. Flamethrowers. Anything to keep people away.

Anywhere but here Solomon - go spread your wisdom among the unwashed masses elsewhere. You've got nothing good to do here and this blog is a place of good people. People who want to live in peace and be let alone. People with your kinds of imaginings and outlook just don't belong. So - go be with your kind and enjoy yourselves.

12:41 AM  
Blogger Doc said...

very nicely put:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8182204992793198984&q=lebanon&hl=en

3:09 AM  
Blogger Solomon2 said...

If you are telling your guests that you don't want to hear their voices, then you just want to look in a mirror, don't you? If all I was interested in was reinforcing my own opinion, do you think I would be here? I like being sensibly refuted, it makes me feel lots better.

Your attitudes aren't just a product of recent history, however, but were carefully nurtured by many people over decades and at great expense. Here's part of how it was done:

Today’s international terrorism was conceived at the Lubyanka, the headquarters of the KGB, in the aftermath of the1967 Six-Day War in the Middle East. I witnessed its birth in my other life, as a Communist general....

...In the mid 1970s, the KGB ordered my service, the DIE — along with other East European sister services — to scour the country for trusted party activists belonging to various Islamic ethnic groups, train them in disinformation and terrorist operations, and infiltrate them into the countries of our “sphere of influence.” Their task was to export a rabid, demented hatred for American Zionism by manipulating the ancestral abhorrence for Jews felt by the people in that part of the world. Before I left Romania for good, in 1978, my DIE had dispatched around 500 such undercover agents to Islamic countries...

6:19 AM  
Blogger HCB said...

They are not my "guests", Solomon. And you are not a welcome "guest." This is "Beirut Live" - not a place for the likes of you to come to be "sensibly refuted." It certainly is not a place intended for your pleasure in dispensing your Solomon's wisdom so you will feel good.

Do you not understand your heroes have destroyed a country for no good reason? Your heroes have bombed people out of their homes and killed them for no good reason. Your heroes have literally shredded human beings into ground meat with not a second thought. Your heroes continue to inflict misery for no good reason. The farthest thing from the minds of your heroes is to attempt any kind of humanity. And you say on your blog Lebanon has some 6 billion dollars in gold so it is without need of aid. Israel has that much in its bombs alone. Will you tell the United States to pull the aid plug on its military robot in the mideast? You and Your heroes are the ugliest kinds of inhuman bullies imaginable.

And you come to spout your nonsense in the midst of their attempts to heal. This is not Palestine, Solomon. It is not a place for you and your heroes to come in with your bulldozers to turn the rubble and evict the hopeless from their Israeli created hovels. This is a place where these good people come to be together with the hope of finding some respite and to talk of the common horrors your heroes have brought to them. There is no interest in hearing your self-proclaimed wisdom as to why they are wrong and brought it on themselves.

Go away. Go be with your heroes and talk of your bombing successes and how your prime minister realized his boast to turn the clock back 2o years. Tell your bloodthirsty defense minister his promise also came true - no one will ever forget his miserable name. He will live in infamy with the prime minister, the IDF and the IAF.

Those people love to hear people like you talk. We don't. We don't care why you barged in. And we don't care what you think of us. Just leave.

6:46 AM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Zionist ideology equal to colonialist expansionism

Movement rooted in oppression of Palestinians, racism

By Pejman Novin

This is addressed to all those people who attempt to smear individuals who disagree with the political ideology of Zionism.

What is the issue? The issue is that Zionism is a European, political school of thought which came about in the late 19th century. Therefore, one cannot say that Zionism equals Judaism since Judaism has existed for over 3,000 years, whereas Zionism has been around for less than a century. The fathers of Zionism were two men named Theodore Hertzl and Chaim Weizmann, who were both self-professing atheists, a significant fact considering that Jews were promised the land by God. Labeling someone opposed to Zionism as racist and anti-Jewish is akin to calling someone opposed to apartheid as anti-white. The Zionist ideology can be characterized by three qualities: settler colonialism, expansionism and racism ... the Muslim Students, along with the support of many other student groups on campus, last week attempted to educate students about the oppressive history of Zionism.

Why does Zionism equal colonialism? The history of Zionism has striking similarities to the first European settlers in America and their attempt to annihilate the Native Americans. The Jewish settlers arbitrarily created a state based on the United Nations' resolution of partition. The result of the matter is that the indigenous people of the land, the Palestinians, have been reduced to less than a quarter of Occupied Palestine's present population, living on less than 15 percent of the land. According to George F. Kossaifi, chief of Human Development in the United Nations, in 1948 approximately 1 million Palestinians fled. Since that year, close to half a million have been killed. Israel has ignored every U.N. resolution condemning its brutal nature. Israel has rejected General Assembly Resolutions 194 (III), 3089 D (XXVIII), 242, 383, 237 and 681. These resolutions, voted on by countries of the world except the United States and Israel, have declared that the Palestinian people should be compensated for property losses and should be entitled to equal rights and self-determination, including withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the six-day war. Furthermore, the UN denounced the Zionist political ideology as racist.

Why does Zionism equal expansionism? There are at least two methods by which an ideology is propagated: expansion by colonization and expansion by ideology. Ben-Gurion, the first prime minister of Israel, said to the World Council of Opal Zion in Tel Aviv in 1938 (cited by Israel Shahak, Journal of Palestine Studies, spring 1981): "The boundaries of Zionist aspiration include southern Lebanon, southern Syria, today's Jordan, all of CIS-Jordan (the West Bank) and the Sinai."

The Zionist ideology sought to occupy much of the Middle East. Israeli armed forces have failed miserably to defeat the Southern Lebanese people, although in 1982 they killed 20,000 civilians, wounded 30,000, and left over 600,000 people homeless (Christian Science Monitor, 1982). Ideologically, however, Israelis, with the aid of the United States, have been very successful in sedating the anger of the Arab people outside Palestine by establishing a puppet government and leaders. This is why the corrupt and non-democratic regimes in the Middle East receive billions of U.S. tax dollars. Last year alone, Egypt received $2.5 billion. An estimated $3 billion was given to Israel as agreed by the Camp David Signing of 1978. Ever since the inception of the state of Israel, based on the most conservative figures, the U.S. government has given $68,531 billion of our tax money to Israel (George W. Balls, former ambassador to the United Nations, in "Passionate Attachment"). As a result, our taxes have nurtured a racist ideology.

Perhaps nothing is more evident about Zionism than its racist attitude toward its own people and others around the world. Internally, the Zionist regime has unofficially classified its people into four groups, the Ashkenazic Jews (the white European Jews who are now in control), the Sephardic Jews (who are mainly Arab Jews), the Ethiopian Jews (who are treated as third-class citizens) and the Palestinians (for more information, see the New York Times, "Sephardic Jews see indictment as just more bias," April 28).

It would take a few issues of the Daily Bruin with all of its 36 pages to name all of the atrocities that have been committed in the name of Zionism. I will cite just a few examples as a way of clarification. Between December 9, 1987 and November 30, 1991 over 5,000 Palestinian children were treated for gunshot wounds in Gaza, according to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency. Another 12,000 children were treated for injuries sustained from beatings by Israeli troops.

One can trace Zionist Israeli racism to its founding father, Weizmann, a close friend of General Jan Smuts, South Africa's future prime minister. Smuts pushed the British government to adopt the Balfour Declaration in order to construct a Zionist colony under British direction (N. Kirschner, "Zionism and Union of South Africa: Fifty Years of Friendship and Understanding," Jewish Affairs, South Africa, May 1960). It is perhaps for this reason that Israel supported South Africa's former Apartheid regime with lethal weapons. In compensation, Israel continues to export diamonds, although Israel itself does not produce them. The ramifications of this cordial friendship between the Apartheid and the Zionist governments run even deeper.

The Ethiopian Jews are treated as lesser Jews; their blood is unacceptable and has been "thrown away" (L.A. Times, March 1996). Even the Sephardic Jews who have lived among the Palestinians for centuries have been treated as second-class citizens (New York Times, "Sephardic Jews Rally for Accused Politician," April 24).

The crimes of Zionism have transcended borders, however. The Israeli government is responsible for training a death squad in Nicaragua, testing nuclear weapons in Cameroon and bombing an American Naval ship, USS Liberty, thereby killing 32 Americans and wounding 75 (Balls, "Passionate Attachment").

It is time to hold the Zionist ideology responsible for its action. For too long it has been hidden under the cloak of anti-Semitism.

Many practicing Jews are not Zionist. The world would be hypocritical to denounce Apartheid and not Zionism. Furthermore, the United States is hypocritical to call for human rights in China and maintain Israel as its closest ally. The anti-Zionism stance is an anti-Oppression stance.

Why isn't this issue debated in the media? Why don't we debate it on college campuses? Muslim students at UCLA along with other conscientious students want to lift the taboo on Zionism and allow the other side's viewpoint to be heard.

7:32 AM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Bush neo con considered 9/11 attack as a bonus to them that Americans were not aware of. They have concrete excuses to convince the Americans why US must invade Iraq for the sake and benefits of Israel as well as to achieve their mission in accordance to Bush neo con and CIA project syndicate.

We will not be surprised there shall be more plots in their trump cards to make it happen.
I assume numbers of US CIA have been dispatched to Lebanon to organize their movement secretly without the knowledge of the Lebanese government and his people.

8:43 AM  
Blogger Solomon2 said...

Do you not understand your heroes have destroyed a country for no good reason?...you come to spout your nonsense in the midst of their attempts to heal...Go away. Go be with your heroes and talk of your bombing successes... We don't care why you barged in.
- HB, September 4th, 2006

[we] did not think, even 1% that the capture would lead to a war at this time and of this magnitude. You ask me, if I had known on July 11 … that the operation would lead to such a war, would I do it? I say no, absolutely not”.
Hassan Nasrallah, August 27th, 2006

Once upon a time, a country existed that rocketed its neighbors indiscrimately...when avenging Allied tanks encountered resisting German villages, they reduced the buildings to mere memorials, and the villagers to penury. No one seems to consider these actions a crime today. What would be wrong if Israel levelled Gaza and drove its inhabitants away tomorrow?
- Solomon2, July 9th, 2006


Look at that last date: three days before Hezbollah abducted the Israeli soldiers. If enough Lebanese had read those words might Nasrallah have aborted the operation, so that hundreds of Lebanese and Israelis would still be alive today, with their homes intact? Do you still think it is desirable for me to stop blogging and commenting?

I know that the Lebanese have had enough of war and wish to heal now. Yet Lebanon needs to do more before peace can be assured. Return the Israeli soldiers. Every other Arab nation - Syria, Egypt, and Jordan - has returned captured Israeli soldiers per agreement. Only Lebanon is breaking its word - and paragraph 3 of UNSC 1701 states that their UNCONDITIONAL return is a precondition of the cease-fire. For the sake of a last inhumane dig at Israel, are you not risking renewed war and violating Lebanon's national honor and unity?

3:07 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

If you think you are right, go ahead
After all, Israel has ignored UN resolution umpteen times, why bother about 1701

Remember, you cannot change someone’s point of view against their will
Take a look at our own biases and prejudices, we all have different ones.

Case closed

4:00 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Like a squeak in the stair that just won't stop - a mosquito in the middle of the night. A constant minor irritation that is hard to ignore.

Yadayadayada

Are you threatening renewed war, great brave killer of women and children? Of course you are - you are Israeli. Born of outrage foisted on the world by terrorism and chutzpah. Inhuman. Obnoxious. Always bursting in where not wanted to whine and cajole.

The one good thing about what you write is your mention of "Lebanon's national honor and unity." Israel has no honor - national or otherwise. And its unity? Any rational person is soon shouted down by a group of senile old men claiming to be "real" jews who want nothing more than to kill all "Islamic Fascists." Netanyahu is Begin all over again. Olmert and Prevetz are the Keystone Kops with bombs instead of water guns.

But - you insist on hanging around to yell your profundities. As it is with Judeo Fascists - go where they are not wanted, cause as much grief and misery as they can and then tell their victims it was all their fault and give them a list of what they must do to avoid further misery.

My only relief is that if the God you people say you believe in really exists, you will be in misery for eternity. My God would not do that - but my God doesn't teach His children to do the inhuman things your God insists on.

You make me laugh - "a last inhumane dig at Israel?" No - I'm not laughing. I'm resigned to the fact of Israel's bloodthirst. Who else would have dreamed up the "Ultimate Mission" five star tour of Israel's struggle? And had the gall to charge for it with a tax deductible, required "donation" so that Israel's sugar daddy would pay for even that bullshit?

Stick around - a guy you will really like a lot and who will like you even more will be here shortly. His name is "Sam." You'll know him by his vile attacks and filthy language. He lives in the US but is a wannabe Israeli.

4:32 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

I cannot imagine how I missed this, Solomon, but I did:

Once upon a time, a country existed that rocketed its neighbors indiscrimately...when avenging Allied tanks encountered resisting German villages, they reduced the buildings to mere memorials, and the villagers to penury. No one seems to consider these actions a crime today. What would be wrong if Israel levelled Gaza and drove its inhabitants away tomorrow?
- Solomon2, July 9th, 2006

You really ARE a nazi, aren't you? Sort of a combined Ribbentrop and Goebbels for the moment but a wannabe Himmler. Bulldozers and bombs instead of gas chambers - is that the idea? What, indeed, "would be wrong if Israel leveled Gaza and drove its inhabitants away tomorrow?"

That, of course, was the entire premise behind the creation of Israel - burn the arabs out, demolish their homes, drive the survivors out with Begin led terrorism and take over the land. Not even an Anschluss or a Ribbentrop inspired treaty ala Molotov. Just the bullies and their bombs. And - since you mention it - hasn't Israel already done what you suggest it should do? What, other than an Israeli prison is Gaza? The people have been reduced to your toys that you torture periodically for your sick pleasure.

Here's what will please me and what I think is coming. Not tomorrow or even next year. But you can look forward to it for your grandchildren. The United States will tire of being a target because it maintains its mideast base in Israel. The United States will talk with Saudi Arabia and Jordan and will agree Israel must go. The situation will be much as it was at the end of WW2 - what do we do with these pests? The NEW mideast will be formed and the map will not include Israel. Rather, Israel will be relocated to someplace near Algeria or Tangiers. The UN "Right of Return" resolution will be codified as International Law, Palestinians will return to their homes and Israelis will be given a stipend with which to start their new lives. There will be no IAF and no IDF. Israel will be treated more kindly than the American Jewish community wanted to treat Germany (for that idea, read The Conquerors) but it will be removed.

You can shit on your sugar daddy only so many times. And King Solomon would know that.

5:10 PM  
Blogger Solomon2 said...

hcb, you are entitled to your own opinions, of course, but you are not entitled to your own facts. If there is nothing you can offer us to increase your credibility or disparage mine, then why should anyone believe in your arguments or opinions? Why do you believe in them yourself? Why play the role of willing sap that dead Communists and live dictators and Islamists have assigned to you?

5:34 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

The real question is, what purpose do you serve other than to irritate?

Why is it your concern if I believe my own arguments? It certainly is not my concern that you agree with me - or even understand me. Do you have some mission of spreading YOUR truth? The propaganda Israel pushes so hard to salve its whining? The one thing I WOULD like you to understand is that you have absolutely no hope of persuading me to your inhuman, completely nonsensical position. The other thing I'd like you to notice is that I don't go to your living room to talk about my feelings or insist the people gathered there listen to me.

Since you obviously feel the same about my "arguments and opinions" as I do about yours, why not simply shut up about mine? Prattle on about something or someone else. You said your fun is in being "sensibly refuted." Obviously, therefore, you are not having fun.

But - being a whiner and interrupter - you must just keep on talking. You'd be much better off at an Israeli tourism site. The people here HATE what you and yours have done. I see no excuse for it or for the people who did it. I am so thoroughly disgusted with people like you barging in with the idea of justifying the inhumanity of insane bullies turned loose with modern weapons that I refuse to even consider anything you might have to say. And, if you were close enough, I'd take you by the scruff of your neck and throw you bodily out the door.

Israel is run by completely inhuman, unthinking, insane, bloodthirsty animals who should be euthanized. Someday the good people in Israel and the good people in the United States will finally remove their cancers and a brighter day will dawn.

In the meantime, don't presume to talk to me about my arguments or opinions. They are what I think of you and yours. And what you are doing is reinforcing them. But - I wasn't talking to you.

The ONLY reason anyone in the entire world listens to ANY of the crap that comes out of that little wart on the water is because the United States funds it and has the ability - economically and militarily - to enforce its rantings and ravings. Take away the bloodthirsty neocons presently running our country and Israel had better be doing some fast thinking or beating feet. It's that simple.

6:11 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Solomon2 your wating your time, it's like talking to a wall. Howard aka HCB is very one sided and just to darn smart and good for any person with a different view. He tells any of us decenters that we stink, have small units and stuff like that.

He started his own blog of other peoples post but no one will go there and have a conversation with him so he stays here and spreads lies and hate. Talking to Howard is like talking to a 13 year old from the inner city.

Good luck in trying to talk reason with him, he starts the insluts then moves it up a notch until you come back at him. After you do come back with an inslut he shows his true colors and say that your aggressor and antaganist. After that point he'll call you out to fight then hide behind lies and a screen name hoping his little friends like Doc, Lilu, Peach and other people come to defend him. None of them even go to his site, well Doc did for one post.... One!

To Funny Howie!

6:40 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Amazing - I agree with Sam. There's no sense in you trying to talk to me.

About the blog - it's a private one. This one is public. We don't let Sam in.

As I told you earier, Solomon - he'll like you a lot.

7:04 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Ya Howard it's private alright....

Why attack him Howard, oh ya he doesn’t agree with you so attack him. At least you’re consistent in your stupidity and biased ness. Unlike you I’m not looking for anyone to support me, I do fine on my own. And don’t ever agree with me again on anything, well maybe when you finally admit to the world you’re a complete coward and useless tool.

Did you find your wife and kids?

7:15 PM  
Blogger Solomon2 said...

"Those whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad."

7:18 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Sammie - you and he insist on trying to make this blog about you and him. why? Why not get a life with like minded people? If you think so little of all of us here - why do you insist on screaming into the wind? Why does your buddy insist on posting his inane little quotes? Do you really have nothing better to do than draw ire from those you interrupt?

Let me make it clear, Solomon - Sam has never understood: I HATE what Israel has done. I HATE what Israel stands for. I HATE people who spout the Israeli nonsense about how everyone hates them and, therefore, they must kill the haters. I HATE people who come to a place like this to spew nonsense bait in the hope their disruption will make them feel better about themselves by being "sensibly refuted" (and I think you meant "rebutted," but, of course, I don't pretend to be Solomon.)

How can it be clearer? Sam is right. There is absolutely NO chance of changing my mind in the slightest. Think of me as an Islamic Fascist - it's a more readily comprehended bumper sticker statement.

I've read your latest quote again - "Those whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad." And the "gods" in this case are the Israelis?

Sam - you need your spell checker even for the little words. "inslut?" "antaganist?"

But - again - Sam is right. I have no use for people like you and him. I have no desire to know people like you and him. I have no intention of giving any serious thought to anything either you or him might say. I think the root of all evil in the middle east is Israel and there is nothing in this world that will change my mind about that. I don't think all of Israel is populated by crazed, bloodthirsty followers of Olmert and Prevetz - we've had thoughtful Israelis on here and Sam has mentioned some of them. But there is neither excuse nor justification for what Israel has done and continues to do to Lebanon. And it matters not if you argue until you are blue in the face and present UN resolutions or anything else in the entire world. You said it once before - there are no treaties or agreements between the wart on the sea and Israel. And so nothing Israel says has any basis in truth or intention in any event. Israel will do as it damned well pleases. Until the US pulls the plug on money, machines and munitions.

By the way - if you think my insults are hard to take, imagine the insult of a cluster bomb in your bedroom.

7:38 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

I only wish the cluster bomb was delivered to your bedroom Howard.

You tried telling me and the world that I was a terrorist, you took my post and used only a section to try to shame me. The typical move of a Dem and hater like yourself.

I care not to spell check anything Howie. Thats just me, and this blog has been taken over and will remain so. So many have left and not becasue of Just Sam, you're to blame as well. How does it feel? You're as guilty as me but at least I'm not a traitor and pussy.

7:51 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Oh ya Howie, you respond to everyone's post as well, you're trying to make it about you too. Why did you open the other blog and openly say that you will use posts from this one? If none of us matter why do you attack us, why not the guys who run this site? Who died and made you the speaker of fools from
America? As for people who dissagree, keep bashing us, keep making it about us. You're a tool who loves to read what he writes and start wars too. You're a fraud and filled with hate. Your the reason the world is the way it is. Did you convert yet? your religon is a joke anyway so why not get a towel and a Koran and become one of them 100%.

7:56 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

John Pilger - Breaking The Silence
(Expose of BushCo neoCon Imperial Iraq Lies)

Sam, your heart is blind, Bush and Neo-Con are the mother of all evils.
The terrorists of the centuries

http://respectuk.blogspot.com/

8:45 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

My heart is blind? I'm glad it's only my heart that is blind. you people are blind in mind & body and spirit.

Follow the unfaithful, lead the uneducated and destroy the innocent. The creed and cry of the Muslim.

I am blind to the haters, I have become a hater like the muslim but only towards the muslim. As where the muslim hates the Jews and Christians of the world.

8:54 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

I support Bush with my heart and soul. If it takes killing a million muslims to protect one American I am for it. You people killed 3000 people on 9/11/2001 so as I see we Americans have a long way to go in our fight to stop your way of life and the terrorism that you have started. I pledge all that I am that our people win the war on terror what ever the cost. If that involves your families, women & Children so be it. The line in the sand was drawn via your freedom fighters. You want to live by the sword then be willing to die by it too.

9:01 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

And people can keep bashing Bush and the American Gov because thats all you people have. As where your view is one of looking up and crying, ours is one of looking down and laughing.

9:08 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

3,000 people muslim and non-muslim.

Both Snr & Jnr killed almost half a million of innocents civilian, women and children.

How many children were killed in Twin Tower?

You are one of the kindest person I have ever knew.

9:10 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Oh the Muslims called their losses "collateral damage". Ya know I'll have to look into how many kids were killed, they were mostly on the planes from what I remember.

500K, wow now I know you're a pot head. That many people weren't killed in the war in nam so how did we kill that many you little bomb making Muslim. Where did you get your numbers, from this web site or one of your little towel wrapped terrorist friends?

9:14 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Oh and also, I am not kind in anyway anymore if your from a part of the world or a religon that promotes terrorism. WE kill face to face, you guys hide and try to act like men. And I stress the word try too.

9:16 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

I sympathized who ever the innocent victims killed in the destruction regardless of their nationality, race and religion, unlike you, inhuman and prejudice.

You have find out yourself for the figures.

9:30 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

m2 - let it go. You can see how smart he is by his bs about "WE kill face to face, you guys hide ...." Face to face from 35,000 feet up with a guided bomb launched by a hero in a g-suit who will go back to his comfy bed once he's killed some more.

Sam is the stink left when somebody has eaten badly and uses your bathroom. It will go away - just open a window. There's no sense in arguing with or even talking to a stink.

The stink is so anxious for attention he has tried to post his bill of rights copies and his other nonsense on my blog repeatedly with the repeated promise he'll "tear it down too." He keeps writing and the machine keeps blocking. I tell a robot to ignore him and he shrieks into the wind where no one - not even me - hears him.

He has nothing to say but he wants you to hate him - that's at least attention. A yappy little dog peeing on himself hoping you or SOMEbody will notice. Let him go.

He will, of course, do his "tear down the site" thing again. Let him. He demonstrates the difference between good and evil - he talks death and misery and revels in what he imagines is "tough talk." His kind are always the loudest talkers and the first to tuck their tails in and run.

I talk to him when it amuses me to watch him turn splotchy red while he tries to think of something new to say. And then he spurts and sputters and the filth spews out of him again with all its misspellings and grammatical errors and non sequiturs.

He'll self-destruct. Let him.

9:34 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

I know I do, if I go by your figures the holacasut never happend either.

Most Muslims say that they're against terrorists then turn right around and strap a bomb to their children and send them to die. Thats why all of the suicide bombers are so young, you use the uneducated and stupid ones.

9:38 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Howard, you came back. My scared little one. Is it lonely hiding in your busy little blog site?

Come out and play, make the this the Howard Sam show as always. You play right into it everytime. You just love to hear how smart you are via your own words. You tell everyone how useless it is to talk to me but yet you do it everyday.

Okay you've been a spineless coward for so long your words are funny as are your post. Howard the Hack.

9:41 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Sheik Ahmed Yassin, whose Islamic militant
Hamas group has carried out a series of suicide bombings in Israel, said he
was not interested in exporting such attacks to the United States. "We are
not ready to move our struggle outside the occupied Palestinian land. We
are not prepared to open international fronts, however much we criticize
the unfair American position," Yassin told reporters in Gaza City.

9:44 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

wrong posting site, sorry.

9:47 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Hcb, I am not angry at him nor hate him.

My observation, he could have been bullied and ignored by the surrounding that contributed to his negative emotion. It is natural for one to let go his frustration to any one he meets.

I understand for people of such behaviour. In many ways, anger is an expression of fear. This fear occurs when one of our basic needs is being threatened, for example the need for safety, for freedom, being ignored, or for any of the forms of acceptance, such as respect, acknowledgement, recognize and significance. We bring our emotion we ever we go, therefore, we cannot allow our emotion control us because threats are more often psychological than physical.

Therefore, the anger must not mutate into hatred toward the people of an entire nation or religion or ethnics group. It is unwise to make generalization about any group of people.

10:22 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Well too late for me, I guess your a better person. I lump all of the muslims together now. It is fear, the fear of any more idiots terrorizing our land. Were better than you people and we don't deserve blood being spilled on our soil. Keep it in the part of the world which means less, well it means allot. The oil there is why we care. How can we get it without involving the towels.

10:40 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

Hey Homo, I mean Howard. How come your posting about me? You keep saying that you will give me no time but yet you continue to do so. Then you won't let me post there. Coward to the end, being a coward you remove bits and chunks of my test to make your self look oh so wise. Why not go back and grab your hate filled messages, your comments about my sexuality. Why didn’t you tell people how you attacked me and others….. Oh ya one sided views and opinions.

Howard wake up and smell the shit you’re shoveling. If anyone one here really believes you then they as retarded and lost as you. I don’t see anyone posting in your blog; I guess they see through your lies and bullshit and for what you really are. A coward and asshole.

10:55 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

sam

From the moment you lose control, angry and retaliate (even if you are right) psychologically, you've lost the battle.

You can't go to war, because you cannot think wisely. An angry man, more often than not, make wrong decision.

10:59 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

I would believe you if we didn't kick everyone's ass in WWI & WWII. I mean everyone and we wern't angry, we were PISSED OFF! WE made the wrong doers pay dearly for messing with the States. Back then we faught men not cowards that used women and children as shields. The muslims are getting good at it.

11:23 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Sam

O.K I speak your language

You are a joker, if you said you are not angry then you do not have go to war to kill the innocents.

Logically speaking, in modern human life, we often frighten away those who we need and care about most. Besides this, prolonged anger has clear health consequences. According to Dr. Herbert Benson, these include heart attacks, hardening of the arteries, strokes, hypertension, high blood pressure, heart rate changes and metabolism, muscle and respiratory problems.

So your choice

11:32 PM  
Blogger Sam said...

M2Timechange, I have no reason to bad mouth you or what you are saying. I understand your points and feel that your very well educated and not one sided. I just think that your in the wrong place, this site is filled with one sided hate filled people like myself. You're to good to be here and it's a shame to see you waste your time with all of us.

The time fro understanding in this blog passed a long time ago. Now we focus on hate and miss leading the people.

11:44 PM  
Blogger M2Timechange said...

Sam

I am really touched and appreciated and I understand how you feel.
We have to give good advice and help one another, share the knowledge with all the bloggers here. I am still learning from our friends here and from you as well.

We have to acknowledge and understand the suffering of Lebanese and Israelis civilians who are innocent and ignorance of the whole situation that end up in this destruction because of irresponsible leaders. We must consider what would be the reaction if we are in their shoes. We are human being with feeling is being divided because of different race, religion, cultures and up bringing need to be treated as human being.

The leaders involves must be accountable for their ruthless and unforgivable acts.
That is all I can say.

12:11 AM  
Blogger Sam said...

You speak of tolerance and wisdom. My place is to keep people like Hcb, Doc and Peach inline. That’s all, if not they will corrupt all they touch.

1:03 AM  
Blogger Doc said...

hahahah, sam youre funny. you group all of us together as if we all believe the same thing...dude you have no logic in your arguments.

m2--dont be fooled by Sam, he is the one you should stay away from, poor guy. I hate HZ, but also Israeli policy and US policy.

"The leaders involves must be accountable for their ruthless and unforgivable acts."---Right on, M2.

1:56 AM  
Blogger Sam said...

Sure praise Bush for not giving in, kill more worthless middle east people. Prasie Blair for hanging tough. Kill Pres Tom of Iran, the Prime Min of Leb, the wacko leader of HZ and any other Muslim leader that promotes terrorism.

1:58 AM  
Blogger Doc said...

"kill more worthless middle east people"?

i feel sorry for you, Sam.

2:01 AM  
Blogger Sam said...

Key word "worthless", not all.

5:35 PM  
Blogger JustJoe said...

I feel sorry for you all. Each side is blind and like a blind man without a cane or eye-seeing dog, you fling about, carelessly tossing about stats and news blurbs that may lend some credence to your version of events. Pitiful. We are headed for all out conflict and it will be at the behest of those similar in mind and spirit to Hcb and Doc. Their ignorance and single minded bias will cause the chickens to come to rest. We Christians are beginning to awaken to the threats posed by Islamists and their apologists to world peace and humane ways of life. What a pity that the muslim masses will be the ones to pay the price of medieval logic.

9:57 PM  
Blogger JustJoe said...

Hey Hcb and Doc, why do you not at least pay lipservice to the concept of balance and denounce the cult of death and destruction espoused by that paradise of Islamic virtue called Iran. Is it because you are intellectually incapable of mental exercises that demand an open mind? Are you fearful of reprisal? Or is it more simple than that? Perhaps you desire bloodshed and understand that Iran and its economic, military and intelligence apparatus guarantees a Lebanon fraught with violence and the death of innocent civilians. Of course, all of that could be avoided by a mass conversion to the tenants of the Koran.

11:13 PM  

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