Thursday, August 17, 2006

No time to waste, time to reconstruct

(Clean up crew in Dahieh)

Only a couple days since the end of the war and people have already focused their efforts on reconstructing the country and aiding the people who have no more homes. Hizbollah is already donating some US$15,000 to every person who has lost their homes. Prominent businessmen and private companies have already pledged money to reconstruct 12 bridges. The government is already surveying all the damages incurred and is getting ready to present its needs at an international conference expected to be held in Sweden on 31st August. Even airlines are planning to fly back into Beirut International Airport shortly, with MEA landing today and British Airways flying in early next week.
Our country shall never bend down and we shall show to the world what the word Lebanon really means.
However, it seems not everyone is very glad about the reconstruction conference Sweden will be hosting for Lebanon. The Simon Wiesenthal Center, an anti-Semitism awareness group, on Wednesday slammed Sweden's plans to host an international aid conference for Lebanon as "discriminatory", saying the meeting should also address the needs of Israeli victims of the conflict. A statement issued by the Wiesenthal Centre accused the Swedish government of "exclusion and discrimination". Last I checked, not only is our country completely devestated by Israeli air raids, but we also recieve absolutley no yearly aid from America. If I am not mistaken, every single bridge, road, power plant, airport, factory, telecommunication center, water treatment plant in Israel is intact. If I am not mistaken there was absolutely no blockade in Israel. How is a Lebanon aid conference "discriminatory"? And please Wiesenthal Centre don't call us anti-semite, we all are semites here.

88 Comments:

Blogger lola said...

Damn Right!!!

2:25 PM  
Blogger JoseyWales said...

Let's reconstruct better and bigger to the glory of Nasrallah and Iran.

So that Israel has bigger things to blow up when 1701 goes down in flames.

It's pointless to talk about conferences/reconstruction etc...If we want a normal life, we need to have the bases for that. The gvmnt indecision and people running around with HA flags ain't it.

2:54 PM  
Blogger mrtez said...

Joseywales,
The reconstruction of lebanon is going hand in hand with a complete political reconstruction. the current days are different than the previous days. we are all talking about building a state, a united one.
we are working on building these bases, but we cannot forget about building our country back. no one will be fooled into another war today, No one...
and like Jumblatt stated today: if we dont build a strong state, if we dont reconstruct to take into consideration everyone in lebanon, then when the shame of olmert will be replaced by the vengance of netenyahu, we, the lebanese will repay the price.
the building of the solid lebanese state will not be an easy affair, but at last we are all talking about it...

3:07 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Don't get too comfy with Hezbollah...they may just be the demise of the country again if you do.

3:10 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

israel will always be the demise of the country with or without hez. their dark cloud will always linger over Lebanon and Palestine.

3:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Last I checked, not only is our country completely devestated by Israeli air raids, but we also recieve absolutley no yearly aid from America"

Oh, but you should check how much do you receive yearly from Iran.

3:58 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

If the Lebanese government can get its act together and give Hezbollah a reason to participate more in the political process while de-militarizing them, then Israel (even if Neten-yahoo came back) would be hard pressed to ever be able to justify another attack. The Israeli government, in my view, wants all the land they can grad. If Lebanon can stabilize itself, Israel will be forced to deal with them as though they were dealing with Egypt and Syria.

Of course, if Hezbollah ever won control of the government, I'm sure Israel would be taking to arms again. It's a tough balance.

4:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

ok we'll check our account balance and see how much iran give to lebanon then we'll check israels account to see how much america give to israel.

4:05 PM  
Anonymous hitler said...

"Oh, but you should check how much do you receive yearly from Iran."

Oh, you must be talking about Hezbollah. Last i checked the conference is about giving aid to the country and not the hezb.

silly cracker!

4:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hopefully all of you get to live by the hezbollah's sick and twisted rules...

If everyone gets 15,000 from these people, imagine the trailer you could build! *dreamin*

Kiss your blog bye bye.

Democracy and Extremism will never work together. Think about it.

4:11 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

rick, i completley agree. But have Israel ever had to justify attacking us or Palestine. I mean a real justification not a sugar coated PR exercise to keep the masses at bay. If they want more land then they will use whatever justification they can, with or without Hizbollah. Will Hizbollah really disarm when they know that Israel are always on the look out for a slice of Lebanons land? Im not convinced that will happen

4:15 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

to 4:15...if you think Hezbollah is there to protect Lebanon, you are gravely mistaken, and HAVE given into their propoganda.

4:20 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Anon 4:20pm
And when did i say that Hizbollah are there to protect Lebanon? I think you read the post in the wrong context.

4:26 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

anon 4:15... the only times Israel has ever had justification is when they were attacked first. Despite the Hezbollah attacks in this case however, I see mutual blame. Israel still occupied Lebanon and continues to hold many innocent Lebanese.

I guess what I was getting at was that once Lebanon can be perceived by most of the world as a stable nation, it will be a lot harder for Israel to attack. Though I do believe they covet southen Lebanon, a stable government in Beirut makes Israel the clear aggressor. I don't think public opinion would allow that... I think the peace this time was facilitated in part by world opinion turning against Israel.

4:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Rick, again i agree with you. A stable Lebanese government is key to peace here and for the country's image. It's just difficult to imagine anyone convincing Hizbollah to disarm...and then implementing it. Just as i can't imagine how anyone will convince Israel that they dont need, or have any right, to more Arab land.

4:44 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Your concern is well founded. But I did see an encouraging sign this time around. The Arab league took a stand, and people listened, especially the French. I don't think the Israeli government will ever be convinced it doesn't need the land...the deterrence factor just needs to be high enough.

Of course it would also help if we had a U.S. Administration (Dem or Rep) that would begin considering Arab interests as well as Israeli.

4:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Arab interests like blowing up airplanes or flying them into buildings?

4:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Oh god we've got another uneducated one on the loose!

5:03 PM  
Blogger mikealpha said...

Rick,

There are Islamic interests but not Arab interests. That's why Nasser and Saddam are gone. Dubai has little in common with Gaza.

5:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Israel receives about $3 billion in direct assistance each year, roughly one-fifth of the foreign aid budget,------. This largesse is especially striking since Israel is now a wealthy industrial state with a per capita income roughly equal to that of South Korea or Spain.

The Israel Lobby
John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt

5:39 PM  
Anonymous Amal said...

I hope and wish for Lebanon to be rebuilt to its glory. Im not sure what is really the meaning of the word Lebanon as mrtez writes but it certainly in the past to date means a lot of good things but also stupidity and weakness in governing and letting be governed by Iran and Syria and Hezb.

wake up and get rid of Iran and Hezb and Israel.

6:05 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Countries like Iran who Jam outside TV signals, and censor the internet and books, and music, quite simply NEED to be taken out...they have no right to choose for people... and to live like kings themselves while they oppress their people. They censor everything so the people can't understand, and if they truly believed they were right, they would let the people see everything and come to the same conclusion.

Muslems are brainwashed idiots. ...yeah, it's just an opinion, but it's my opinion.

6:10 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Shimon Peres in United States

in Atlanta and DC to raise humanitarian funds for northern Israel,

He spoke at a news conference organized by U.S. Jewish federations, which have launched a campaign to raise money for humanitarian relief for Israel.

When asked whether Israel plans to offer some of the aid money raised to help with humanitarian efforts in Lebanon, Peres said there are other ways Israel has already helped Lebanon.

he said : during the war, some Arab countries wanted to send civilian aid to Lebanon, and we agreed that they will over-fly Israel," he added. "We let them over-fly Israel during the war."

But when asked for specifics, he said he could not identify the Arab countries or say how many were involved because, in his words, he does not want to "embarrass" them


that was Jordan the only one "king ass hole good for nothing" too little to late

I dont see Shimon Peres providing any help or ask for donations for humanitarian relief to the Civilans of Lebanon.

so why accused the Swedish government of "exclusion and discrimination"

6:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Kiss my ass, anon 6:10

6:26 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The quicker the reconstruction, the better people will feel about tackling the bigger political problem. Both can coincide. We are a nation of survivors, and ALWAYS come back stronger.

The Lebanese prefer to die on their feet, and not live on their knees.

6:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

anon 6:26 muslims are shit, completely worthless and brainwashed same as the assholes here who give money to christian television personalities who buy the dog an air conditioned house worth more than most peoples houses.

There is no god, god is for retards who are either weak of mind and/or can't deal with the fact they must die some day. God is as made up as Santa Claus, but for adults...all the priests diddle little boys because they don't even really believe it....there is no heaven, and there is no firey pit in the middle of the earth.....fuck religion, and fuck 95% of the world population who can't deal with the fact. It's pathetic...it's like thinking the easter bunny shits out eggs....fuck religion and all the weak assholes of the world who can't just simply accept the fact we die and that is it...are you fucking kidding me? Your soul is synapses...in your brain...wtf world?

6:55 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

anon 6:10
Your comments, self explanatory

Not all muslim are bad,
Not all christian are bad
Not all Jews are bad
Not all Buddist are bad
Not all Hindoos are bad
Not all free thnker are bad

It seems that u really hate muslim
Do u ever think if you were born as a muslim?
Do u ever think Bush & republican can kill all the muslim?
Do u ever think this world is for other religon to live but not for muslim?

If u said it's just your opinion, then u shold not not mentioned idiot.
Do u like people call Christians idiot?
Do u ever ask,who created the terrorist?
Why there are terrorist?
Are they fighting, or killing people because of religion?
Why are they targetting at US, Israel, British & Australia?
Why not China, Japan & othere Europe conutries?
The bombing in Spain because of the supports given to US.

We are all human with feeling, to be treated as human being. We have to respect what ever religion they wish to practice.

Please think before you make any comments. U are not small kid.

6:57 PM  
Blogger Chris Baker said...

How about we don't reply to "Anonymous" comments?

Better yet don't allow them.

7:04 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

As you have now noticed, I call all religious morons idiots for giving their lives and money in the hope the easter bunny exists and when they close their eyes one last time, they will find more than darkness.

There is no magic guy living in the clouds...it's pathetic, and weak mined for people who can't deal with mortality and the fact they won't exist anymore one day. EVERY religion.

7:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I pray Lebanon gets back on its feet and recovers soon from this terrible war. And to the anon who called Muslims "brainwashed", the same can be said for Americans with our corporate-controlled media. All the major news outlets are biased and never give two sides to a story. They are owned by corporations whose boards of directors are also on the boards of war-profiteer corporations. The news is entirely slanted. So please, you stupid troll, Americans are just as brainwashed and lied to as anybody else. Your ignorance is astounding.

7:14 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

BTW, I wish there was a god, but basic common sense tells you there is not. The bible and the Koran are so full of such crap that these books actually hurt religion more than they help it....but if you want to believe the earth is 5000 years old, and that people walked on water and parted seas....whatever, but don't think I won't call you a moron....

I feel what everyone does about dying....scary stuff, but making up angels, and men in clouds, or 50 virgins, or whatever is the kind of stuff we tell kids....it's sad that adults need this as well.

7:15 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

anon 7:14 nice of you to enlighten me....too bad every country can't see what you wrote....I can see every station broadcast around the world if I want, and I can get news from every country in the world if I want, and I can talk like here, to every country allowed to talk.....yeah the U.S. news is biased....they all are all over the world, but atleast I have the option of seeking truth.

7:19 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

hello everybody

Notice someone who just came up from pigs tile, the mouth like the pigs ass

7:29 PM  
Blogger lola said...

What's up with the insults? And yes, i agree with Chris Baker. Anon means non-existant. Don't even bother with thm.

7:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"pigs tile" man loosen up the towel on your head and come up with something better than that...

Watch out everyone...my mouth is like unto a pigs ass....now go smack your shoe on my flag and dance around like a monkey camel fucker.

Seems Irans leader has started a blog....I am going to go call him on.

7:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

amusing, anon 7:57, or whatever your name is....your so funny and insightful..i wish there were more people like you in this world...

Please note that this person should serve as the poster child for ignorance and stupidity.

8:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

how much does that pay?

dickhead.

Seems your reply to Irans leaders blog must first be approved before it will be shown? big suprise.

8:24 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

kweek....kweek.....kweek....kweek..
mouth smelly like the ass

8:27 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Here's a thought to debate...can you guess why these people who hate us so much and wish death upon us would still provide us with oil? Money? I think not....they know damn well the minute we have no oil and they won't give it to us, we are coming to take it.

They spew hate at us, we bomb Muslims, but they know better than to withhold the oil don't they??

8:27 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

Nope that spot is taken....... JK

8:29 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

I agree that Islamic and Arab interests are different. In some cases they overlap and in some cases they don't.

I also see that we are getting bombarded again on this blog by flying cockroaches. Please go infest somewhere else.

8:30 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OMFG that last one actually did make me laugh out loud...."mouth smelly like the ass"

OK, I know English isn't your first language, so I will leave it at that. I am sure you have much better insults in your native tounge.

I will however use that at work tommorrow and tell someone their "mouth is smelly like the ass"...

8:32 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sam, I am by far more ignorant and stupid than you...

8:35 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

Everyone just talks, does nothing. To bad the energy can't be foucused. The good and bad.

8:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

holy mothing fucking shit does the entire middle east suck....china and russia are pussies...

Iran....let's get it on bitch. There most be 80 million guns here in civilian hands....nobody even would bother coming here....AK47? fuck, I own a polish made AK47, bought it online for 150 dollars. It's not auto anymore, but it's worthless anyway and won't shoot straight...looks cool though. Easier to aim with a hand gun.

blah blah blah....I'm a troll....no shit.

8:43 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Worse, you're a troll with access to the internet.

8:45 PM  
Blogger phishster said...

hello my people...
looks like the scum is picking up in here...it aint the same without me!!

can the anon people create nicknames it is much easier...

8:46 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

And give up the shroud of anonymity, lola? That would require those trolling to grow a spine.

8:48 PM  
Anonymous sparkels said...

Faque!!

8:53 PM  
Blogger lola said...

Every anon here has no spine, or brain for that matter. Too lazy to pick a name. But they think they are so cool to come on here and diss religion and nationality. What they don't know is, no one cares about them. We laugh at them. We pity them. For they have nothing to share apart from filth. Nothing good comes out of their mouths.
I once told Sam to get out of the bubble that he lives in. Seems we have too "plastic bubble kids" around.
Like i mentioned before on a previous post, I always go by a quote from Voltaire... "common sense is not so common"

8:55 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Get a spine, sparkels.

8:55 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Quite right Lola. Common sense is a relative term, and what it means to a troll is very different to what it means to an educated and tolerant person.

And to think these people are allowed to procreate. Ugh.

9:01 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

Just one thing, you guys always use the education part when someone has a diff view or is filled with hate.

I have adegree, how does that make me better?

Education isn't reading 4 papers per day or listening to 3 different news talk shows. Sure knowing more is always better but I've known people with masters and were very up to date but were complete ass's too. It almost seems like a supremists attitude when people don't agree.

9:14 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

I'm not poking at you Rick or anyone else either, just making an observation and commenting.

9:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

It shall be well with you this year. No matter how much your enemies try this year, they will not succeed. You have been destined to make it and you shall surely achieve all your goals this year. For the remaining months of the year, All your agonies will be diverted and victory and prosperity will be incoming in abundance. Today God has confirmed the end of your sufferings sorrows and pains because HE that sits on the throne has remembered you. He has taken away the hardships and given you JOY. He will never let you down. I knocked at heaven' s door this morning, God asked me... My child! what can I do for you? And I said, Father, please protect and bless the person reading this message... God smiled and answered... Request granted.

9:19 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

I understand, Sam. When I say educated, I mean people who seek knowledge and experiences other than what they already have...people who are seeking to become enlightened. Sometimes that come with a college degree, sometimes not. I work with faculty and spend my off hours with people who don't have degrees and tend to find my friends are far more enlightened.

For a lot of folks coming on here, their idea of "communicating" is spewing ignorance and hate without accountability. True communication is about listening and speaking, and trying to understand one another; not just reinforcing views we had already reached.

9:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

anon 9:19 that may very well be the gayest thing I have ever heard...."knocked on heavens door"? wtf ever.

Jesus freaks are no better than muslims.

9:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Not one mother fucking christians lives by what the bible teaches....I actually and honestly have more respect for muslims because atleast they believe and live what they preach....christians, catholics, etc are all a joke....

9:33 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Wow....ignorance just abounds today. You anons really need to grow a spine or leave.

9:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Ignorance is not knowing that "Rick" is fucking anonymous too.

9:41 PM  
Blogger Lilu said...

Rick, the majority of Israeli people, certainly the new generations, has absolutely no interest in southern Lebanon (or Northern Lebanon, or central for that matter). Some small minorities in the Israeli population have interests in Gaza and the West Bank, but at least some of them have already been taken care of (i.e. last summer's elimination of all settlements in Gaza) - and the majority want to be out of there as well.
I don't know what the Israeli citizen Ehud Olmert thinks, and perhaps the Israeli Dan Halutz has some bizarre megalomanic thoughts, but most Israelis have no wish to go near Lebanon - except perhaps as tourists. That is surely my only interest in it.
I'll even provide you with an explanation - the newer generations, my generation, are well familiar with southern Lebanon as a nightmare of battle and death. And the older generations know that place as the graveyard of their children and grandchildren. People have very bad memories from it and wish they could forget that place even exists. At the beginning of the current war, a guy I worked with was called up - he was the last officer from his unit to have been to Lebanon in the previous IDF occupation. He was badly wounded there and has metal plates in all of his legs. This guy, who is usually really cheerful and clownish, was sitting there with tears in his eyes. He said - I don't want to go back there. I just don't. All I have from there are bad memories. I got wounded there, I lost friends there, I just DON'T WANT TO GO BACK. I hope they don't make me go back.

9:41 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

Let it go Rick, I pasted the anon. And I'm proud I did.

9:42 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

OK, so you do give your name, but fuck you anyway....

9:42 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

Anon...I give more than my name....links are clickable, you twit. Yes Sam, i know I need to let it go.

lilu, thank you for that explanation. I should clarify that I was speaking of the PM and the Cabinet, and not of the regular Israeli citizen. I need to remember to be specific about that; sorry.

9:46 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am done for now, talk amongst yourselves...my opinion is hate for muslims, but since my opinion differs from yours which you feel is more mature and adult like, then my opinion doesn't factor...only opinions laced with flowers and smilie faces are counted.

Iran sucks...the muslims there are calling us on, it's coming, I don't suggest planning a vacation there anytime soon. Sugar and spice and everything nice, but my prediction will be the true one....

9:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

PS, don't nyou bguys know if you don't respond I will get bored and go away....LOL have fun kidz.

9:53 PM  
Blogger Lilu said...

well, that's the thing - the population would never allow for any imperialistic plans about Lebanon - there was, and is, enough outcry against the ground forces going in there now; the people just kinda wish they could ignore the place, we would never allow for any leader to get so involved. There would be such an outcry, there would be an immediate change of government. Olmert knows this by the way, it's too obvious not to be aware of it - which is exactly the explanation why the government here has no realistic expectations to ever permanently occupy southern Lebanon. They know they could never get away with it, so they don't plan on that territory either. Shabba is bad enough.

9:56 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

lilu, I am glad to hear there is opposition. That is not something they tend to report on Cnn, Fox, or even al Jazeera. I just hope Lebanon can get stabilized so there isn't even a temptation.

9:59 PM  
Anonymous spam said...

I don't think the IDF/military powerbrokers in Israel want to occupy Lebanon, but it sure looks to me like they want to keep it weak, divided, and with a few "terrorist bases" in the South, to justify their existence, keep the billions of dollars of military aid rolling into the country. Whilst I'm sure a whole lot of Israelis want to live in peace, the problem is that their leaders dont, any more than Bush/Blair want the "war on terror" to come to an end. The articles on this site about Hizbollah's outlook are really interesting, and confirm my opinion that Hizbollah's aims are primarily defensive. All the crap about Hizbollah and Iran wanting to drive every Jew into the sea is just propaganda: listen to what they actually say and look at what they actually do.

12:50 AM  
Blogger Lilu said...

Spam, have you read through the article by Amal Saad-Ghorayeb?

for the second (or is it third?) time, I will quote from the piece:

In perhaps one of the clearest indications of Hizbollah’s view of the nature of the Israeli threat and hence Hizbollah’s determination to retain its arms, Qassem affirmed as recently as two months ago that, “our opinion is that Israel’s existence itself is a danger."

THAT is what they actually say. Maybe they don't want to drive every Jew into the sea, just the ones living in Israel.

3:33 AM  
Anonymous i care said...

FEMA could really take a lesson from Hezbollah and Lebanon as a whole. The Lebanese resiliance never ceases to amaze! You are amazing and wonderful people, may God's light continue to shine on you.

3:47 AM  
Anonymous ritzl said...

Lilu, If only it were that simple. In Lebanon, Israel's interest isn't land, it's water. Are Israeli's willing to reduce their standard of living to reduce their need for Lebanese water? I don't know the answer, but I would suggest the motives of the Israeli population are mixed at best.

Here's a link: http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/lebanon/2003/0115wa.htm

4:45 PM  
Anonymous sam said...

but Lilu - spam is spam it means spam just ignore spam as it makes no sense and is stupid

fack

6:44 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Is it shell shock? Post traumatic stress disorder? undeveloped synapses? Why are some people here serious, concerned and hoping to conduct some kind of conversation while others seem to want simply to toss grenades in the place to watch them explode? Do you hate and filth purveyors just have nothing else to occupy your time? Why come here if you don't want to add something? What's the point? So you can sit wherever you are and giggle? It does no good - we don't even know your reaction. So you might as well just write the stuff down, stare at it and then set fire to it.

8:17 PM  
Anonymous spam said...

yes hizbollah believe israel's existence is a threat to lebanon - I think they have good reason to think that. That still doesn't mean they want to drive every jew living in israel into the sea. I imagine they just want an end to the apartheid state aggressive land- and resource-grabbing israel they have had to live next to. It's regime change, just like the U.S. and its allies wanted in iraq, and that's what the iranians have been going on about too. If israel let the refugees back and allowed the palestinians in the occupied territiories have equal representation in the israeli/palestinian state, then that would effectively constitute regime change and a one-state solution to the problem. Of course there are not enough powerful people on either side of the conflict of sufficient vision/bravery/folly/idealism to make that happen and as I said before, the powerful ones usually have an interest in keeping the conflict going.

8:47 PM  
Blogger Lilu said...

You're fishing for comfy interpretation there, Spam, it's too bad. I think HZ mean exactly what they say, they have never been ones to particularly vague and beat around the bush - except maybe when Nasrallah threatened to shoot missiles at Tel Aviv and they landed in Hadera instead (but maybe he got his maps wrong). If they were for diplomatic changes I imagine they would work on that front, no?

Again, from the article: "Every single experience we have had since 1948 until now is an experience of aggression, expansion, wars and displacement, imprisonment and killing."
What you are talking about is 1967 issues, when Israel obtained occupation of the Gaza strip, the West Bank, East Jerusalem and Golan heights - HZ are talking about 1948 which is when the state of Israel was born.

Perhaps the only place HZ are being vague are also in the article:
"Asked to specify the exact conditions under which Hizbollah would no longer view Israel as a threat and contemplate disarmament, Qassem answers, “let’s not talk about the reaction but the action…. If the Israeli danger disappears one day and I have no idea how it would disappear, then the resistance which was a reaction to the Israeli danger would no longer be present. "
He's basically saying, if you want up to put down our weapons, get rid of the state of Israel. Sweet.

Ritzl, hardly anyone here cares about Lebanese water - as far as most people are concerned, our water comes from the Sea of Galilee (bordering Syria not Lebanon). Perhaps the politicians have it in the agenda but water is definitely not part of the Israeli people's motives. We're hardly aware of it.

9:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

thank God HZ did not hit Tel Aviv, although they could have if they wanted.

As far as HZ and Israeli motive, they are one in the same. One wants to get rid of the other and one wants to defend themselves from the other.

So the Lebanese need to be clever to deal with HZ as to give them importance outside of weapons and defense.

More important though, is to step in quickly and fill the void that was left by the lebanese gov't in the south: provide economic and other aid to people in the South, so that HZ doesnt receive the boost it needs to continue its existence. The Lebanese dont care about HZ as a force to destroy Israel, but rather as a force to defend against Israel...remember that HZ is also a huge social organization...without them, alot of people would not be so well-off. If the Leb govt stepped in to take care of its people adequately (e.g. defense, economic, health care), then HZ would be less necessary or valuable in the eyes of the people. Why do you think Nasrallah called on the displaced refugees to return to the south immediately? These are his constituencies...without them, HZ would be nothing.

The international community needs to think outside the military box and start thinking wisely and innovatively to curb the popularity and necessity of HZ.

11:38 PM  
Anonymous spam said...

Lilu, I agree with you in assuming that people mean what they say, until it can be proved otherwise, so please tell me exactly where hizbollah say they want to get rid of every jew in israel. An end to the israeli state does not necessarily mean an end to jews living in that region, any more than the end of the East German state meant a wholesale exodus of former East Germans.

I quite understand why hizbollah are not interested in specifying when they are going to disarm, before the issue of israeli aggression is addressed. It is like saying to the battered wife, "why don't you just leave?" when the question should be put to the husband "why do you keep hitting this woman?".

As for hizbollah trying to work things out diplomatically with israel, you must be joking! The current israeli leadership is more likely to send one of its death squads after Nasrallah than pick up the phone to him.

I think you should reflect on the fact that Hizbollah did not exist before Israel's bloody 1982 invasion of Lebanon, and also on the fact that Israel's brutal occupation of Palestinian territories has created another ruthless Islamic militia (Hamas) amongst the Palestinians who used to be among the most secular and outward looking of Arabic peoples in the region.

2:33 AM  
Blogger Lilu said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

3:49 AM  
Blogger Lilu said...

Oh but I was refering to HZ in general, throughout its history. As you pointed out, HZ have existed for over 20 years now, with the same modus opperandi the entire time - the current Israeli government is barely a few months old. There have been countless governments of various political directions in Israel, but only one HZ with only one goal - fighting. They've never even tried diplomacy, it's been a policy of fighting from the beginning.

But never mind, I see where you're getting at - HZ don't want to get rid of the Jews. They just want an end to the Israeli state, and that's just fine. You have yet to point out anything negative about the idea so I take it you agree with them. You seem to imply that an end to the Israeli state should pose no problems to us jews living in it. Is this what we're talking about?

And by the way - Nasrallah was quoted a few years ago saying the following about jews: "if they all gather at Israel, it will save us the trouble of going after them world wide".

But of course, they don't mean to put an end for jews, not at all.

3:56 AM  
Anonymous spam said...

Do you have a context for that Nasrallah quote? For instance the full interview in which it occurred?

I am quite ready to believe that he and many hizbollah people have hatred in their hearts for jews, but that still does not mean that destruction or expulsion of all jews is part of hizbollah's organizational aims.

As for preferring fighting to diplomacy; they are a resistance movement and fighting is what resistance movements do. Nevertheless there were talks between israel and hiz over prisoner releases in the past and from 2000 (when IDF left) until 2006 (the current war) there were no rocket attacks or deliberate targetting of Israeli civilians (some Israeli civilians were hurt or killed by falling anti-aircraft ordnance - just as some Lebanese civilians got caught in the crossfire on the other side. This is nothing unusual in hostile border situations.

What you have to ask yourself is why the israeli state didn't try a little diplomacy itself in order to get its soldiers back (who I very much hope are still alive), instead of bombing Beirut international airport? I repeat that the disprortionate response of the IDF has strenghtened hizbollah's position not weakened it. This is not good news for israelis who want to live in peace, but it might be be no bad thing from the point of view of their militaristic leadership who clearly don't.

Finally I am sure that "the-end-of-the-israeli-state-as-we-know-it" (if it ever came about - MOST unlikely) would pose problems for jews living in israel (just as the end of the apartheid south african state did for the whites) but it might solve some problems for other peoples who live in israel and around its borders,

10:12 AM  
Anonymous Amal said...

spam you are just spam so shut the fack up. bored listening to your one sided arab islamic world bug that you have.

good luck with life when you will have to give up free internet, tv, film , culture, speach, life, food, fun , sex etc etc...

suggest you go live in iran so can enjoy the life....

3:10 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

Ditto Amal.

Spam, you use the kind of double speak that all "diplomatic" jew haters have always used. Now you want to argue about the "full context" of the Nasrallah quote? Go look it up. And while you're at it, look at this site:

http://www.zwoje-scrolls.com/shoah/camps.html

It will give you an idea of what happens when decent people listen to your kind of double-speaking, trying-to-sound-reasonable "argument" which is really nothing but slick sounding spam. Just like the little bully kid who says, "prove it" when he's accused of bullying.

Let's see - Hizbollah doesn't want to get rid of all jews - just the country. But the jews can simply wander around in what used to be Israel? And Hizbollah is simply a resistance movement and fighting is what resistance movements do? Well, killing fighting resisters is what defense forces do. Especially when the resisters demonstrate their complete disregard for their own and anyone else's life by going to some happy place to blow themselves up to kill as many men, women and children as they can. That's your "resistance fighter?" They are trained to think this life is terrible and they ought to get to the next one as quickly as possible? But take some of the "enemy" with them?

That is the sickest kind of sewer sludge imaginable. Steep the kids in so much hatred and so much bullshit disguised as Islam that the kids will blow themselves up.

If it were up to me, I'd take every "resistance fighter" I could find, tie him or her to a tree and send him or her to heaven with my m-16. And I'd do it in the happy knowledge that I am saving their children's lives and happiness from the idiots who rutted and created them. By the way - the male martyrs get a couple dozen virgin women to enjoy for eternity? What is it the little girl martyrs get?

This horror is bad enough without people like you and your "resistance" buddies running around loose. You want to kill Israelis and imprison your own people in some perverted interpretation of Islam while you kill your own kids in the name of martyrdom.

You can be glad God loves you no matter your faults. God will still let you into heaven. But your sick, perverted bullshit "religion" promises only hell. Or virgins if you kill yourself.

4:25 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

By "your religion" I didn't mean to condemn Islam generally. Only that parody of Islam that represents a "religion" that teaches children to blow themselves up and to hate everything the "religious teacher" hates in his paranoia induced delusions of grandeur.

5:43 PM  
Blogger Lilu said...

I'll save spam the trouble of the look up - Nasrallah was quoted by the Daily Star, from a speech he gave at a graduation ceremony in October 2002 in Haret Hreik.
http://web.archive.org/web/20021024133755/http://www.dailystar.com.lb/23_10_02/art5.asp

You know, you're just embarrassing yourself with these failed attempts at ambiguity, not to mention you're skirting the real issues with pseudo-political correctness. We're talking about what HZ's real intentions are from the cease fire onwards. It is quite obvious what you're getting at. Stop the distractions and just come out and say what you mean flat out. At least stand behind what you believe in - do you agree the solution to the problems of the Middle East lies in the end of the Israeli state?

And spam, where are you from?

5:47 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

OK, since there is not a thread on this yet... does Israel not understand the definition of a cease fire?

They launch a raid deep into Lebanon, striking at Hezbollah's ability to be supplied by Syria. Now Lebanon is threatening not to deploy more troops.

Is this just Israel's way of making sure that the cease fire doesn't last? They agreed to stop shooting except in self-defense. This raid was not self-defense. This is mind-boggling.

6:48 PM  
Blogger HCB said...

The trouble is how "complicated" the whole thing is. Here we are watching the "birth of the new mideast" while watching the birth of new martyrs and the birth of bigger, better, bullying Israel. With the midwife cheering the whole thing on so we can win the "war on terrorism."

Such complications - all these competing ideas and ideologies. And all the blood let because each side despises and fears the other. Now we're told "if it's Tuesday it must be Armageddon" by some guy who has carefully studied the situation and has decided Iran might launch a nuclear war next Tuesday because it's so convinced the whole thing has to be sorted out in heaven with the infidels in hell.

So - the Israelis say "ok" to a cease fire. While they expect they'll reap the PR benefit of that announcement they know Hezbollah will violate it. Maybe by grabbing a couple more soldiers posted in the middle of a field as bait. When Hezbollah (being a whole lot smarter than Olmert and Bush give them credit for) doesn't - Israel comes up with something else while their warplanes streak overhead. During all that, the "resistance fighters" are gearing up for yet another battle and rocket attacks and Hamas prepares smaller kids with bigger bomb belts - easier to sneak into places like nurseries.

Rick - they are ALL crazy. It's a shame, there are good people like Lilu and Carmel in Israel and there are our hosts in this blog and there are so many "anonymouses" who are good. But the evildoers and haters at the top are getting all the attention. George Bush could stop the madness but he can't break the trance and couldn't memorize the words if he could wake up so he can't give the speech. Cheney is in his bunker watching "Doctor Strangelove" and masturbating over an old, manipulated photograph of Henry Kissinger.

It's a mad, mad, mad world.

Like I said and you all poo-pooed me: Beer is so much more than just a breakfast drink.

7:36 PM  
Blogger Rick said...

hcb,

the visual of Cheney with Kissinger it just way too vivid! :-)

Yes, quite right... after all, what are civilians? Simply mere pawns in this game. It's kinda like the politicians here... war is an "academic" exercise since their kids aren't doing the fighting.

Let's take the radicals from all sides and lock them in a huge room with all the alcohol, firearms, and ammo that they can handle. Then whoever comes out gets banished to Antarctica; let's see how much cause they can drum up for a holy war with penguins.

10:01 PM  

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